SUMMARY OF THE MEETING OF REGIONAL COLLEGE COMMITTEES
FOR THE VANCOUVER - LOWER MAINLAND AREA� held at Carson
Graham Senior Secondary School» North Vancouver, B,C.,
on April 5th» 1967 at 8:00 pomo
List of those in attendance is as follows:
Mro Howard T. Sagehorn
Oro Paul Jo Wisch
/Dro J. Do Chapman

SoNoFo Chant
.,,Mro D. W. Franklin
Mr .. Harry Evans

v/Dr,,

./DrG Roy Eo Lo Watson

i/ Dro Walter Hardwick
/l-tr F NA,, t?.owell
v

e , '1iugh
a , ��Ferguson
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�l1L Wo J" Wallace
1/M , Len Sampson

Davis-Macconnell-Ralston, Palo Alto p Califo

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Department ot Education p Victoria, BoCo
Academic Board

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Academic Board, Victoria 9 B.C.
University of British Columbia
Conmnmity College Association o! .3oC.,
School District Noo 45 (West Vancouver)

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v1.:A , \I .. E � Lucas
v '-: . .., �v., Bo F:romson
V"1:r·. E. F" Miller
.. Dr,, Gaorge Wilson
c/Itro W., F'" McGown
�ro Co Po Jonas

School District Noo 44 (North Vancouver)

/Mro Peter Co Wilson
v J-. _<!) • �
v' Mro Do Ho Campbell
/'Ylro To Jo MacDonald

School District Noo 46 (Sechelt)
School District Noo 48 (Howe Sound)

/l4ro Ko Mutter

Secretary, Regional College Steerlng Committ�e
(40, 41, 42 and 43)

./4... 7Yl. �Y?�/ �
/, Q_ J-.Ho ��
v'Mro
Mo Campbell I
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v' Mr Co To Rendle
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c/Mro IoHoRo Jef""fery
Mro Co Nichols

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3o E. Wales

Jo E .. Robertson
Wo McOuat

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Chairman» North Shore Regional College
Coordinating Committee (44 5 45 P 46 and 48)

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School District Noo ltO (New Westminster)
School District Noo 41 (3urnaby)
School District Noo 42 (Maple Ridge)
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School District Noo 39 (Vancouver)
Director of Vancouver City College
School District Noo J9 (Vancouver)

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Mr. Ao Hatcher

f7�
Harold Stafford
Mr. J. R .. Dimham

l�.�.�_,-y\,

ChairmM• Regional College Study Committee
(356 J6, 37 and 38)
School District Noo 35 (Langley)
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Mr. E .. Marriott
Mr. w. Beagle
., Mrs o Jeanna Miller

School District Noo 36 (Surrey)

l'1ro Roy Thorstenson
v'Mr. M ., Adam
Mro Jo Jo Lentsch
Mro C., F. Sayl,:).
,,, Mr. J. E. Hill-Tout
Mr .. F. Gingoll
v Mr.. D. Fonseca
.tMr ., J. V ,. Smedley
vMr. B. Davis
/ Mr o t.lo c. Robinson
ilfwlr. A. F. Frith
/•1r o ,..To Cot,l'an

School District Noo J? (Delta)

Mr .. w. Graham
R. B. Wilkinson

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School District No o J8 (Richmond)
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Mr. Peter Jones, Chairman of the North Shore Regional Collego
Coordinating Committee, acting as Chairman, opened the meet:lng by stating
that it had been called to report and discuss certain information given by
the Minister of Education to the North Shore Regional College Coordinating
Cotlt!Tlittee at a meeting in Victoria on March 9th• 1967. Mr. Jones then identi­
fied tho groups which were represented and introduced the invited guests,
Dean Chant, Dr. Watson, Mr� Harry Evans, r1ro Dennis Franklin 0 Dr. Chapman,
!�'o Sagohorn, Dr. Wisch, and Dr. Walter Hardwick.
Mr. Jones then advised the meeting of the suggestions made by the
Mini3ter, tha most important being the requirement by the Department of Education
for �n ovQrall study or survey of the need and provision of regional colleges
in the Lower nainland area -- a plan which wo1.ll.d ·indicate in general terms the
programs to be offered in an effort to avoid needless duplication. This type
of metro planning for the colleges would require a strong central authoritative
&dministrativs body -- a different concept from the community-sponsored t.ype l'Jf
college growing to fulfil a community's need, as had been previously consid��ed.
Following his introductory remarks, the Chairman called on Dr�
Chapm.an 0 Division of University and College Affair3 9 Department of Education p
to outline to the meeting the information required by the Departmont of
F.ducation to aesist any overall plan for junior college 01>ganization in the
Greater V,rncouver �rea o In summary, this information may be listed es follous:

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the magnitude of Jeniand; that is the number of sr.ud nt"> to
oe ac.c:onurodat ;

(2)

the character of the demand at both the secondary and tertiary
levels;

(J)

the optimum lO'.!at on for colleges:(a) the location for minimum distance of travel, and
(b) the locac.ion for the maximum use of all educational
resources tr· .. he area;

\ 4)

the established .e· ns by which the c...evelof111ent of the colloges
can be coord.inat-<l •

.Speaking more z. ec;.flcally, he indicated that the infornation t.o b
presont.ed to the Departme'1t should be organized under two headings:l;

a demonstration of tr.a demand -- the number of students
graduating from GrDde XTI on variois programs, not only
inmediately but �s predicted for n number of years in
advance, and

2)

an �verall plan of the proposed junior colleges as rslateJ to
each other and to all post-secondary educatiom1l institutions ln
the Greater Vancouver area�

Dro Chapman pointed out that one oi" the factors which complicat.ed
any ovr;rall plan wa.., the different rte of development of plans in th several
propoFsd ?egional college areaso He a-emphasized the need foi- an overall
study of the requirrn!1ents o" the a :-ea and the possibility that the bast type
uf organization might be one of cont:ralized contr·ol ..
The Chairm.1n thi.m introduced :fro Sagehorn of Davis - 11acConneJ.l rmlston 9 of Palo Alto, California, who�e group were in the area <laing a st� 1
f'or the West V.ancouver School Board, and who had extensive experiencc1 in
co unity arid junior college plannir1 6, Mr,. Sagehorn introduced his rems ks
by pointing out that the terms ·•con.:.uunity collega", "junior college·' and.
n1•egional collage n mean d:i.ffel"ent t 1ings to different people .. Any one of
these might be an institution designed to teach liberal arts. It m:l.ght also
include technical instruct:5.on and occups.t:tonal skill training., It mjght 'e
involved in the so.J.vaga of adults. in t.he teaching of recreational activit 1.. _,
in the presentation of community ser'Tices and progra.maias designed to coJ1trib1.ot,"'
to the culture and economic improvement of the community and i,s citi,, ns
r
any oth !" educational activity req·1ired by the c mmunttyo 'rhe s · 2',f' of r
colloge ,ill be deterr.Jined by two facto:t's
the type of offerings which
p ans ·'"'o p ovide, nnd the ultimate number of students who m. ght nv ,1 the
of it� facilitioso
Mr.. agehoMl ·1,1as of the opinion that befo't'e details could b,
out cert�in basic info:r11,ation must bo obtained
T'nis ha outlined , s:

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the overall org�nization and curriculum;

(2)

a long-range (25-year) prediction of enrolment, with the
saturation point estimated;

(J)

the general location of individual colleges;

(4)

a detennination of estimated costs;

(5)

a priority schedule of construction.

He then outlined the steps that a cOUlpany such as the one he repre­
sented would take in order to prepare a report. They would:
(1)

project all accumulated data for 25 years in order to establish
the breadth of the problem;

(2)

study each .area in terms of population and proposed course
offerings in order to dete1ffline the eventual size of each
college;

(J) determine as soon as possible, possible sites for the individual
colleges, bearing in mind that tima of travel is a more impo:rtarrc.
factor than actual distance;
(4)

examine trends in assessed valuation of taxable property in
01-der to determine the financial bnsis on which each college
should be constructed and operated;

(5)

make a careful examination of the administrative structure for
tha projected colleges, taking into consideration the educational
advantages and disadvantages of a single overall administrative
organization as compared with separate colleges individually
sdministared;

(6) consult all agencies and authorities in the area for ideas and
opinions relative to community college programQ

Mr. Sagehorn concluded by stating that the completion of a report
of this nature would require six months• study and would cost $30 000.00 of
which approximately $5,000.00 would be for publication, graphics and maps.
Mr,. Jones thanked the speaker and stated that the North Shors
Region9l College Coordinating Committee was of the opinion that an immGdiato
start should be made by the Lover MainlQnd. School Districts to produce the
overall plan required by the Minister of &iucation.
Dr. S.N.F. Chant stated that tho Department of Education is
conscious of the need for good planning for community colleges but is conce�ned.
that school districts do not dissipate their resources with unwarranted
axpenseo

- 5 Mra Hatcher, of the Regional College Study Coromittee, speaking
from the floor, pointed out that there appears to be a trend t.owaros more
coordinated effort in all Provincial Government supported sel"Vices, for
example, an overall plan for hospitalsa The Chairman agreed that if this
is the case then it becomes increasingly necessary that a community college
plan be coordinated as soon as possibleo
Dr .. Walter Hardwick pointed out that the reports that he had m.1de
for two of the areas concerned, the North Shore snd the Richmond-Delta e.reas,
had not been carried out without concern for each other and for the educa­
tional institutions existing in the whole area.
Dr. 3. Wales, of Vancouver City College, pointed out that most of
the study and research for three of the four areas had already been completed.,
and he was certain that the remaining are3 could have its ituation deter.nined
and the whole coordinated and forwarded to the Department of E:iucation for
their consideration, certainly without a six-month delay.
Mr. Wallace, of West Vancouver, was of the opinion that an
independent, overall survey is necessary in order to have the report prepared
in a manner acceptable to all and to have its stated priority basis acknow­
ledged by all districts.
Dro Chapman said he was interested in receiving ideas �agarding the
type of acceptable organization for the administration of the proposed four
community colleges -- ranging fro.m one strong central adml.nistration wi:th
four separate campuses to reasonably autonomous community colleges with a
loosely-structured coordinating committee.
MrG Sagehorn quoted from studies made in the United States to show
that the optimum size of a community college is approxim�tely 3,500 full-time
enrolled students, that there is a trend for the average cost per student to
decrease as the size of the institution approaches this figure, and that
building cost per student is reduced by increasing the size of :i.ndividual
community colleges to approximately J,000 students.
Dro Wisch, Mr. Sagehorn's associate, provided infonnation about the
nature and size of colleges in various part::s of the United States. He quoted
studies to indicate that a district having a population of more than 200,000
should have moro than one junior college. It was his opinion that by 1970,
65$ of all high school graduates in the United States will be in attendance
ot community colleges.
Returning to the subject of a central coordinating junior cnllege
a•thority, Mr. Rowell, of the Comn1unity College Association of B.C., pointed
out the difficulty that such a body would encounter when the fi�st stop in
planning a junior college would be strictly local in its nature, being local
plebiscites in which only the voters of each community could participate.
Mr. Jones, the Chsi:rmmn, was authorized to call a meeting of the
Chairmen of the four cO!l!m.unity college ctlmtllittees� or their reprcssantntive$ g
in Coquitlam on Wednesday, April 19th�

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The meeting was adjourned at 10:)0o
Notice of the meeting giving details of time and place will be
mailed in due course.
Submitted by

Jt�

Wa F. McGown,
Acting Secretary,
North Shore Regional College
Coordinating Committeeo

WFMcG/nc

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NORTH SHORE REGIONAL COLLEGE COORDINATING COMMlTrEE
721 Chesterfield Avenue,
North Vancouver, B.C.

29 March, 1967

NOTICE
TO LOWER MAINLAND REGIONAL COLLEGE CO!MITTEES:
A meeting will be h$ld on Wednesday, April 5th, 1967, at
8:00 pomo, in the Cafeteria, Carson Graham Senior Secondary School,
2145 Jones Avenue, North Vancouvero
Dro Sagehorn of Educational Facilities Laboratory, Stanford
University, who is in Vancouver on other business, has agreed to meet
with us to discuss the possibility of overall planning for community
colleges in the- metropolitan area, and the pros and cons of a super­
regional college with several campuses as opposed to individual collegeso
Dro Chapman and Dro Chant, or his representative, will also
be presento
This is an information meeting only, and all Committee members
are invited to attendo

Co Peter Jones,
Chairman,
North Shore Regional College
Coordinating Ccmmitteeo
CPJ/nc